Hi Tom, thanks for answering my questions! Yes, it would be good to have a flag to turn off the inverse hand because a) having the possibility to look at each spacegroup offers a very effective way of parallelization b) if I "grep" the spacegroup name in the logfile I find: dikay@turn10:-2010/phenix.automr% grep "P 4" mf92.log Space group: P 41 21 2 (No. 92) LIST OF ALL PLAUSIBLE SG: ['P 4 2 2', 'P 4 21 2', 'P 41 2 2', 'P 41 21 2', 'P 42 2 2', 'P 42 21 2', 'P 43 2 2', 'P 43 21 2'] Space group: P 41 21 2 (No. 92) NEW dictDATA {'raw_data': [' P 4abw 2nw', (101.71700286865234, 101.71700286865234, 344.74798583984375, 90.0, 90.0, 90.0), , , ]} space_group : P 41 21 2 all_plausible_sg_list : ['P 4 2 2', 'P 4 21 2', 'P 41 2 2', 'P 41 21 2', 'P 42 2 2', 'P 42 21 2', 'P 43 2 2', 'P 43 21 2'] dictDATA: {'raw_data': [' P 4abw 2nw', (101.71700286865234, 101.71700286865234, 344.74798583984375, 90.0, 90.0, 90.0), , , ]} HALL: P 4abw 2nw P 43 21 2 P 41 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 41 21 2 (92) Space-Group Name: P 41 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 41 21 2 (92) P 43 21 2 * P 41 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Fast Translation Function Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Packing Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Refinement Table (Unsorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Refinement Table (Sorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Best Space Group: P 43 21 2 P 43 21 2 P 41 21 2 * Space-Group Name (Number): P 41 21 2 (92) Fast Translation Function Table: Space Group P 41 21 2 Best Space Group so far: P 43 21 2 Space Group Name (Number): P 41 21 2 (92) Packing Table: Space Group P 41 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 41 21 2 (92) Refinement Table (Unsorted): Space Group P 41 21 2 Refinement Table (Sorted): Space Group P 41 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Best spacegroup from search with first component in permutation: P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Fast Translation Function Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Packing Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Refinement Table (Unsorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Refinement Table (Sorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Best Space Group: P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Best spacegroup from search with first component in permutation: P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Fast Translation Function Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Packing Table: Space Group P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) Refinement Table (Unsorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Refinement Table (Sorted): Space Group P 43 21 2 Best Space Group: P 43 21 2 Space-Group Name (Number): P 43 21 2 (96) which shows that at a certain point the MTZ file's spacegroup is abandoned and the calculation finishes in the enantiomorph spacegroup, which has the drawback that I cannot really compare the best (complete) results of both enantiomorphs. And with one good and three bad search models I don't know if abandoning the given spacegroup early is definitively the right decision (but it's hard for me to tell exactly what criterion the decision was based upon - it may have been after an exhaustive search in #92 in which case my worry would not be justified). thanks, Kay

Message: 2 Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2010 09:07:08 -0600 (MDT) From: "Thomas C. Terwilliger" To: "PHENIX user mailing list" Subject: Re: [phenixbb] phenix.automr questions Message-ID:<[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1

Hi Kay,

I'll answer what I can; perhaps Randy the others may have more comments.

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Dear developers,

I have four questions concerning phenix.automr (I'm using version 1.6.4):

a) is there a way to make the program try all permutations for the search order of my four search molecules, or do I have to write a script ?

It would be a good idea for me to put that in. For now, yes, you have to make a script to do that.

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b) how can I completely switch off the search in the alternative spacegroups - I am under the impression that although the "effective parameters" are all_plausible_sg_list = None use_all_plausible_sg = False the search is not only done in the spacegroup I specified (#92=P41212) but also in #96=P43212 . I believe so because the output says: ... 2 alternative spacegroups SpaceGroup will be determined by highest LLG in search for FIRST ensemble Search order: P 43 21 2 P 41 21 2 ... (I would rather run a second search "manually" in the other spacegroup!)

Yes, it runs the inverse hand even if you say "use_all_plausible_sg=False". However it should not run all the other space groups (all_plausible_sg_list : ['P 4 2 2', 'P 4 21 2', 'P 41 2 2', 'P 41 21 2', 'P 42 2 2', 'P 42 21 2', 'P 43 2 2', 'P 43 21 2']). I'll see if we can put in a flag so it doesn't run the inverse hand if you don't want it to.

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c) I have two occurrences of seq_file ("all.seq" and "all.dat"; the latter is symlinked to the former). Am I right that I could just leave out one of them? I did this after looking at http://www.phenix-online.org/documentation/automr.htm#anch70 but I wonder which of the specifications of sequences and masses overrides the other one? or is the first specification used for editing the search models, and the second for getting the likelihood terms right?

Looking at your parameters file, I see what you mean. If you supply two different files, then yes, the one you specified at the top of your file with "seq_file=all.dat" is going to be used for editing the file for autobuild, and the one you specified in the scope "component" is going to be used for getting the likelihood terms right.

Normally (always?) these should be the same. So normally, just supply the first one "input_seq_file=seq.dat") and it will be used for both purposes.

Or if you have several components, only specify them in the "component" scopes, and all of them will be put together into a single file and used as the input to autobuild.

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d) what kind of editing is done? Is phenix.sculptor run internally? I find {a,b,c,d}_edited.pdb but are they actually used?

Only basic editing to make the model compatible with autobuild is done. No sculpting is done inside automr for now.

All the best, Tom T